Kingwood

[jim stone]

There is a lovely looking Jay Ham kingwood pratten on the IFS. I know virtually nothing about kingwood and wonder what it sounds like. Anyone have info?

[an seanduine]

When I was buying exotic hardwoods for musical instruments (quite a few years ago!) I bought a small stick on offer for a whistle, or possibly a small folk flute in G. I liked it. It turned well, but when I went back for some more, it was basically un-obtanium. My vendor said it had only been available infrequently for some years. I'm a little surprised that Ham could get enough for a pratten style flute. But then, even true cocus is occassionaly available. so who knows.
As I recall, it was darker than the picture available at the wood database website.
From talking to some really old instrument technicians, Kingwood was considered a suitable alternative for cocus. Like cocus, it grew at various locations around the Caribbean, but most of it came out of Brazil. Like cocus, my understanding is that it is over harvested. There might be a lot of it in North-Eastern Brazil, but for a lot of opaque and complicated political reasons, like Pernambuco Wood, it is difficult to get. There might be some from the Yucatan, but the stories I've heard make taking any kind of exotic wood out of that area sound like the 'Wild-West'.
There could be someone with more recent information than my forty year old recollections.

All the best,
Bob

[paddler]

I was gifted a long billet of Mexican Kingwood a few years ago. It is long enough to make a D flute, but I haven't actually used it yet. All I can say is that it looks nice (like the pictures in the link below) and is very dense and fine grained.
I also learned that it is now a CITES listed wood.

Here are some more details:

https://www.tehwoods.com/Mexican-Kingwood

[Loren]

I’ve made recorders from Kingwood, it’s a good timber for woodwinds, though a bit less dense and hard than Blackwood. Most people would notice no difference in tone or volume between identical flutes from the two woods, though I’d say there is a difference: sort of like the difference between Cocus and Blackwood, with Cocus having a bit more of a glassy tone and a touch more volume and cut, but these differences are in a very small degree. Likewise Kingwood has a slightly less edgey tone than Blackwood and a hair or two less in terms of volume and projection. But again, none of this is in amounts that I think most players would notice. The difference sonically between Blackwood and Kingwood is nowhere near as stark as the difference between Blackwood and Boxwood, it is rather, as I mentioned previously, more like the very small difference in sound that exists Blackwood and Cocus instruments, when there even is a difference, as the tonal properties can be opposite between the two woods given an unusually dense piece of blackwood and an unusually light piece of cocus.

I can’t report much on the long term durability of Kingwood as I only recall seeing a few Kingwood instruments come in for regular service and none for repairs. No issues to report. I can say that at the time I left VH they would still make Kingwood instruments occasionally or on special request, which is something they generally wouldn’t do with woods they found problematic over the years, Lignum Vitea being one such wood: VH experimented with making LV recorders and they basically all cracked over time, so they won’t make more instruments from the wood, even though they still have wood stock. Thai Boxwood is another example: It cracks when made into direct blown instruments, so despite having a bunch of logs in storage, we wouldn’t make instruments from it. Interestingly, Thai Boxwood works fine for bellows blown instruments (not subjected to constant moisture cycles), so I think VH eventually sold their Thai Box logs to one or more pipe makers. Anyway, all this to say that if VH still makes instruments from Kingwood, that means they haven’t found it particularly problematic in their 50 or whatever years of experience. Best I can tell from my own observations of recorders and whistles is that Kingwood probably holds up OK over time, assuming the wood was seasoned properly before and during production of the instrument. I have seen cracked kingwood whistles and flutes and these were made by makers who also produced instruments from other woods that cracked, so take that for what it’s worth. Jay has been around for flute making for a long while now,
and learned from one of the best, so I personally wouldn’t have any qualms about buying one of his flutes, though that’s just an opinion, and not a guarantee. I do reckon though that he knows how to properly season wood and produce an excellent flute, all things considered. Time will ultimately be the final judge.

Hope this helps, Jim.

[jim stone]

Thanks, gang!

[chas]

I love working kingwood. It's not quite as tight-grained and oily as blackwood, but most of it is pretty close. One thing I have found is that its properties aren't as consistent as blackwood or boxwood. I got a big board several years ago that I'm still working through. It's maybe the prettiest wood I've ever worked. But the bright red that doesn't dull with age comes with a density of a little under 1, and it needs to be a little more finished to get a good shine. OTOH, most of the king I've worked has a density of 1.19-1.24, is shiny as all getout with no polishing, but it's pretty dark. Beautiful, but more purple-and-black than red-and-black.

The Mexican kingwood that paddler mentions is a different species, often called camatillo. I just got a bunch of this -- very much like kingwood, maybe even more oily than good Brazilian kingwoood. I measured the density of these a little north of 1.2. I'm really looking forward to finishing some whistles with those in about 6 months.