Experiment re Cross Cultural Music and the Psyche

talasiga · Post by **talasiga** » Fri Apr 08, 2005 8:59 pm

Prompted by this other topic started by Dale

Here is the bare scale of a six note raag. I am not going to say what it is. I am giving the scale only and then a typical thematic loop. I have arbitrarily chosen a G tonic for it. Notes below the keynote will be written in bold and those above the 2nd G (the first octave) will be in italics.

If you want to play this game, play around with the folllowing and then vote in the poll.

Mystery Sexatonic Scale
G Ab B C# E F# G

Range of Notes in the Sexatonic Raag
C# E F# G Ab B C# E F# G Ab B C#

A typical simple thematic loop:
C# E F# Ab B C# E F# Ab G

F# E C# B Ab F# E C# E F# B Ab B Ab G

talasiga · Post by **talasiga** » Fri Apr 08, 2005 11:24 pm

Of course I have my answer but I cannot vote now.

Darwin · Post by **Darwin** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:14 am

Color me clueless. I can recognize emotional content in, for example, Japanese and Chinese (Mandarin and Hokkien) folk and popular music, but even American and European thematic music is beyond me. I really couldn't understand "Peter and the Wolf" without a program.

Doug_Tipple · Post by **Doug_Tipple** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:25 am

Talisiga, your question is well-meaning, but there aren't many C&Fers who could register an intelligent vote. Maybe you could revise your question so that us simple Westerners could understand and would have a small hope of voting with confidence.

talasiga · Post by **talasiga** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 2:19 am

Doug_Tipple wrote:Talisiga, your question is well-meaning, but there aren't many C&Fers who could register an intelligent vote. Maybe you could revise your question so that us simple Westerners could understand and would have a small hope of voting with confidence.

Sorry, I am not after "intelligent vote". Dale's topic was about cross cultural commonalities and this is a little experiment I am doing for fun.
All that a person need do is play those notes a few times as I have set them out and say what they feel about it in terms of times of day.

My wife is an Irish descent Aussie - not from my culture at all and not a musician either. When I play something like that to her she will let me know what she feels.

It is to do with feelings. Ultimately no right or wrong.
Just an open ended experiment.
Perhaps someone may feel nothing. They won't be able to vote in the poll. Thats OK.

At this point in time two people have already participated.
Enjoy.

hans · Post by **hans** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 3:17 am

Ah, my first visit to this forum, and on a magical mystery tour! Thanks Talasiga!
Maybe i can try and make it more accessible for us "westerners"?
Well i took ot my keyed flute, and the scale plays well enough on a traditional 8-key flute. then i though tthis sounds very familiar, apart from this last note in the runs: G, which makes it all ending in suspension.
Then i transcribed it up 3 semitones, which makes it very comfortable on a traditional D flute:
Scale: E G A Bb B d e
(written in abc notation, first octave Capitals, second octave small letters).
This is a straight forward familiar pentatonic minor scale: E G A B d, with F and C missing from the normal seven tone scale, and a tantalising Bb added, which is the ending note of the thematic loop.

Here is the thematic loop transposed (b_ = b flat):
E G A B d e g a b b_
a g e d B A G E
G A d B d B B_

So now i am playing around with it and let it sink in.
As for the moment i have not a clue with what time of day i may associate it. I am having breakfast right now, and it does not feel like a morning raag. The whole theme hangs on the last note, the high Bb and the lower Bb, which gives it an enourmous tension and suspension. It really cries for a resolution, either to E or G (in this transposed scale).
I will cast my vote later when i am more familiar with it.

~Hans

emmline · Post by **emmline** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 5:52 am

You don't have to understand the terms...just play the notes.
It was still a bit of a toss up for me, but between two similar times of day.

StewySmoot · Post by **StewySmoot** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 8:18 am

I am going to have to say "High Noon". I never heard of the other movies.

Darwin · Post by **Darwin** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 11:35 am

talasiga wrote:It is to do with feelings.

I know what I feel like when I hear a piece of music, but I don't have any specific feelings that I associate with time of day. Since these feelings don't exist, there's obviously no way for music to elicit them.

Doug_Tipple · Post by **Doug_Tipple** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:39 pm

Looking at StewySmoot's avatar while thinking about Talasiga's sexatonic scale, I felt inspired to record a 43 sec. audio clip of the thematic loop. Hans transposed the notes of Talasiga's thematic loop by raising each note by three semitones, which makes it easier to play on the low D flute. I am playing a low D Irish flute, and the drone notes are an organ tones of Bb and G on the keyboard, per Talasiga's suggestion. I play through the thematic loop twice. I will leave this file up for a few days, and then, thank God, it will disappear.

http://home.earthlink.net/~life2all/sit ... tonic2.mp3

StewySmoot · Post by **StewySmoot** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 1:23 pm

AAAAAAHHHHH..........

Now I get it!

It reminds me of the time of day that is about an hour after horse-feeding time!

dubhlinn · Post by **dubhlinn** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 1:25 pm

I've played the scale on a few different instruments and I keep thinking of the morning after the night before...

Slan,
D.

feadogin · Post by **feadogin** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 4:14 pm

Those notes aren't on my whistle.

J.

talasiga · Post by **talasiga** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 5:31 pm

emmline wrote:You don't have to understand the terms...just play the notes.
It was still a bit of a toss up for me, but between two similar times of day.

Thanks emmline. Yes just play the notes.
Simple. Follow the game.

And no, I reckon your transposition is wrong Hans.I cannot see how you transpose the intervals
G Ab B C# E F# G+
to E the way you have done.
With E tonic it is
E F G# A#C# D#

IE tonic and half step
and 1 and a half steps
and 1 step
and (skipping the 5th note) 1 and a half steps
and 1 step
and a half step to octave.

talasiga · Post by **talasiga** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 5:42 pm

feadogin wrote: Those notes aren't on my whistle.

J.

If you have an A whistle you can do this scale with a cross fingered G

OXX OOO
OOO OOO
XXX XXO
XXX XOO
XXO OOO
XOO OOO
OXO OOO

otherwise, you can just transpose it to any keynote (tonic)
and do it on any whistle using above finger tablature.
(Therefore, for example, on a D flute or whistle you would end up doing it with C tonic,
on an Eb pipe it would be C# etc etc)

There is nothing special about G.

Alternatively, you can adopt the classical indo fingering system
on a D pipe.
G will be the three fingers down and the next note would need to be half holed which I will represent as %:-

XXX OOO
XX% OOO
XOO OOO
OOO OOO
XXX XXO
XXX XOO
XXX OOO+

Chiff and Fipple Forums

Experiment re Cross Cultural Music and the Psyche

The mystery scale and theme is evocative of

Experiment re Cross Cultural Music and the Psyche