Why are there so few female pipers ?

[rorybbellows]

I am reading Sean William’s book on Irish traditional music at the moment and in the small section on Uilleann pipes she states that the ratio of female to male pipers is about 20 to 1. It doesn’t say how he came up with this figure ,but its probably about right.So why are there so few female pipers? Could it be that the pipes are just to much of a physical instrument to play,or could it be that the pipes themselves are inherently a male instrument like lead rock guitar or saxophone. Could it be cultural and women are just not expected to play bagpipes?

RORY

[PJ]

So why are there so few female pipers?

I suspect that it's because pipers' wives are more patient and understanding than pipers' husbands.

[uilleannfinlander]

well, earlier men went to pub to play ..women stay home with kids.Fiddle and whistle/flute were much more easier for wifes with during normal houseworks to put away or play than pipes...heard thiskinda explanation. .
who knows.

btw Anybody knows couple where both plays pipes ?

[TheSilverSpear]

"Could it be that the pipes are just to much of a physical instrument to play,or could it be that the pipes themselves are inherently a male instrument like lead rock guitar or saxophone."

Yeah, too physical for women. Women can't handle tough physical exertion. That's why so many women rock climb, ride horses, run marathons, ski, swim, cycle, and a zillion other sports at the highest levels of competition.

And no musical instrument, or any other inanimate object, is "inherently" male or female. It has the cultural constructs we erect around it -- that's it.

[gregorygraham]

Fairly obvious answer to this question. Traditionally men control household finances. Pipes are expensive. Mystery solved.

Not that I'm a male feminist or anything.

The suggestion that women are less able to cope physically with pipes than men is pure rubbish. Just think of the current generation of pipers in your locality. Lots of women among the best. Here in Toronto, Debbie Quigley and Kelly Hood. Lots in Ireland too.

[PJ]

btw Anybody knows couple where both plays pipes ?

Did I read that Pat McNulty taught his wife and that they played a few concerts together?

Edited to add:

Here's an article on Pat McNulty. In the second last paragraphs it mentions that he and his wife, Anne, pipe together.

[Joseph E. Smith]

I think the answer is fairly obvious: Women are smarter... just like the song says.

[bensdad]

Men have automatic and unexamined prejudices, such as assuming that Sean Williams is a man, which she certainly isn't.

[Jäger]

"Could it be that the pipes are just to much of a physical instrument to play,or could it be that the pipes themselves are inherently a male instrument like lead rock guitar or saxophone."

Yeah, too physical for women. Women can't handle tough physical exertion. That's why so many women rock climb, ride horses, run marathons, ski, swim, cycle, and a zillion other sports at the highest levels of competition.

Well, if you look at it historically, the horse riding, mountaineering, running long distances etc. were all done by males, and piping is just one of those that haven't gone through that shift yet. So yes, of course it's a social and cultural construct, but then again, so if everything, more or less.

[highland-piper]

Highland pipes are even more physical than Uilleann pipes, but there are female GHB players. Little kids, too. The ratio of males to females in GHB is probably about 20:1 too.

In Barry Green's book, The Master of Music, he talks about how certain musical instruments appeal to certain personality types. Probably has as much to do about it as anything.

Bagpipes play a continuous stream of sound with no rests and no dynamics. Maybe women feel their voices are better suited to that.

That was just a joke. And don't tell my wife.

Looking at it from the other way around, fiddle is more delicate, and more expressive (through dynamics, etc.), so maybe that explains why, on the whole, fiddle (e.g.) is more appealing to more women than pipes (relatively speaking).

[bogman]

There has been a big shift with GHB in the last few years and I think the ratio is some areas is a lot smaller than 20:1 now. There were very, very few female GHB pipers a few years ago, probably seen as a man thing as mentioned before, but not now. I think the balancing out thing will just take time with UP too.

[Uilliam]

Methinks it is because the Female Pipers I have seen have been far far better than the majority of male pipers that I have seen.
Now then, in a mysogynic society ruled for a millenia by Patriarchy that just won't do.So we have a closing of the ranks by the boys and a rather condescending or even sexist attitude to girls.Some of the replies to Rorys little feeder to the pondlife have displayed this.Honestly can ye imagine women fluttering around the house with a babe in arms, a dinner to look after, the houshould to care for, with a penny whistle tucked in her pinny, so she can wip it oot and play the odd tune.Physical strength !whit the feck are ye talking aboot?London has had women firefighters for a couple of decades and I don't hear anything bad aboot that only that it took them so long to do it.Enough of this pish.. Women Rule OK well Queen Elizabeth does Get over it.
Slán Go Foill
Uilliam

[TheSilverSpear]

"Looking at it from the other way around, fiddle is more delicate, and more expressive (through dynamics, etc.), so maybe that explains why, on the whole, fiddle (e.g.) is more appealing to more women than pipes (relatively speaking)."

Jaysus, the misogynist comments and flagrant gender stereotyping on this thread just get better and better. I like the presupposition here that things which are "expressive" and "delicate" are automatically feminine, which I know is bound up with a lot of cultural constructs that have historically disempowered women. Women were (and to an extent, still are) kept out of certain professions and activities on account of their alleged delicate nature. All that is a load of BS but the fact that people in 2010 are still happily writing this shows that even in the age when we might have three female justices on the US Supreme Court, these notions of gender inequality are alive and well.

Liam, good post.

[highland-piper]

"Looking at it from the other way around, fiddle is more delicate, and more expressive (through dynamics, etc.), so maybe that explains why, on the whole, fiddle (e.g.) is more appealing to more women than pipes (relatively speaking)."

Jaysus, the misogynist comments and flagrant gender stereotyping on this thread just get better and better. I like the presupposition here that things which are "expressive" and "delicate" are automatically feminine, which I know is bound up with a lot of cultural constructs that have historically disempowered women.

Don't shoot the messenger.

What world do you live in where women aren't, on the whole, different from men?

You can choose to disbelieve this, but I swear: my wife can identify the sex of a violinist/fiddler simply by listening, with about 99% accuracy. How could she do that if there are no differences at some basic level?

I don't care if it's cultural, genetic, learned, taught, right or wrong -- it is what it is.

[Nanohedron]

Come ON, people. I think Rory's just trying to find a date.