Chromatic keys - How do they work?

[Uilliam]

Thanks MT am getting ma B Majors and Bb Minors mixed up

[pancelticpiper]

The bottom line to Chromatic keys: How do they work?

is that they don't work like the keys on a clarinet (for example) in that the purpose isn't to allow the chanter to be able to play all scales/keys with more or less equal facility. Yes I have all the keys on my D chanter so it's theoretically possible to play in any key. But as a practical matter, if I (or probably any piper) were to play in six sharps or five flats on a D chanter it wouldn't sound like much.

Well the keys work like the keys of a clarinet to a limited extent: I've played things in the key of C a number of times on my D chanter at various studio gigs, because on my chanter low F and high F are bang-on and can be played with good facility. But I have to explain to composers that though the D chanter is capable of hitting G# and Bb etc there isn't much that I can do with those notes: all the cool notebending etc the composer wants is only going to happen on the open-hole notes. Composers are used to keyboards and other "legit" instruments and write things in whatever keys they feel like. The manner in which "folk" instruments favour certain keys is alien to them. (It shouldn't be alien to them, though, and shows ignorance... clarinetists for example will often go out and buy an "A" clarinet for sharp keys, which are very difficult on a normal Bb clarinet. And trumpet players often own trumpets in different keys.)

[Ian Lawther]

I have had similar discussion about Northumbrian pipes with people who want to buy a 17 keyed chanter because it is fully chromatic over 2 octaves (NSP does not overblow - to get extra notes the chanter gets longer with keyed notes). In the cases of both uilleann and Northumbrian pipes we are dealing with a simple one or two keyed instrument nominally in D and G (and the related minors) which have had accidentals added to them. Orchestral instruments, particularly after the introduction on Boehm instruments are designed to get multiple keys as Panceltic has described. I think the keys on pipes were added more so that pipers could add "color" to the basic scales rather than go off and play odd keys.

Ian

[andyp]

Churlish, Uilliam; maybe you should get out more.

[rgouette]

It's a good piece of music though, isn't it?

I think so too..<while ducking the forthcoming Uilliam rebutt to the previous post>

[NicoMoreno]

Well, as my dad always says, there's no accounting for taste!

[rgouette]

Well, as my dad always says, there's no accounting for taste!

heh this reminds me very much of the many past discussions around pipes coupled with a certain rectangular instrument ..that makes whooshing..ethereal sounds....

[Uilliam]

Churlish, Uilliam; maybe you should get out more.

Hya Andyp Welcome to the forum
Right thats the lovey dovey bit o'er wi.
I've just noticed your little comment on me being a peasant from whence the term churl derived.
Interestingly enough ITM is Peasant Music ,played by peasants for peasants.
I am totally unawares of a jig called Titanic therefore when playing ma Irish pipes( for lo, that is whit they are) the toon frae the film Titanic would not even entereth ma heed.
I only play peasant music therefore am truly churlish.
As for me getting oot more pray that when I am ,that oor paths do not cross, ya bampot
Have a nice day ye all and peace and prayers to yous whit are troubled of mind.
Slán
Agat
Uilliam

[PJ]

Interestingly enough ITM is Peasant Music ,played by peasants for peasants.

Well said. Couldn't agree more. In fact, so much of music is, at its source, peasant music. All this Riverdance and Titanic stuff is mere Broadway/Hollywood inspired window dressing. Clapton playing Crossroads, McCormack singing Danny Boy, it's all the same.

[caedmon]

This is probably a question without a single correct answer, but I want to ask it anywho. Should a beginner focus on a keyless chanter first and become comfortable with that before exploring a keyed chanter?

[Podge]

Makers usually leave the mounts on so that keys can be added later. A beginner may not wish to go to the expense of 5/6 keys at the very beginning.

I have a fully chromatic chanter and I use all the keys regularly (playing tunes in A, Dmin, backing songs in F or EMaj, etc.). It takes a lot of practice to become fluid.

The only difference (apart from the extra notes) is a little extra weight on the chanter (it is noticeable to me).

[lundblad]

One thing about notebending though.
I have only the Cnat and Fnat keys and I find the Fnat key very effective in bending the note by opening the key slowly and closing it slowly as well.
Rob

[pancelticpiper]

One thing about notebending though.
I have only the Cnat and Fnat keys and I find the Fnat key very effective in bending the note by opening the key slowly and closing it slowly as well.
Rob

On my chanter the F natural in both octaves is only in tune with the chanter off the leg (on the leg the F is rather flat).

This is actually a good thing because I can hit the F with the chanter on the leg then slowly lift to get a nice bend up to an in-tune F natural.

It sounds plain or lacking in expression when I hear pipers who have chanters that the F is in tune on the leg play F: the note just suddenly happens and there's no bend/change of pitch.

[Joseph E. Smith]

This is probably a question without a single correct answer, but I want to ask it anywho. Should a beginner focus on a keyless chanter first and become comfortable with that before exploring a keyed chanter?

Most of the notes that you will ever need can be accomplished by a technique called "cross fingering" (you'll learn more about that later as you gain skill), so yes, I think a keyless chanter perhaps may be a better learning stick than a more expensive keyed stick... just an opinion however.

[CelticMusicLover]

Sorry for resurrecting this old thread, but I'd like to know how to cross-finger F and Bb. You see, I found a way to play that last segment of "Hymn of the Sea" on my low D whistle by cross-fingering those notes, and it'd be great if I could practice cross-fingering those on my Pakistani-chanter (don't ask ) until I recieve my Daye-set.


Btw, does anyone know if there is a cross-fingering chart somewhere on the web? That'd be lovely to have!