Oiling a wooden Irish flute...

flappy · Post by **flappy** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:31 am

How can you make the difference? From a phamarcy it should be 'cosmetic' I think?!

Feadin · Post by **Feadin** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:33 am

I've got my almond oil from a pharmacy too and found it's completely clear and has barely, if any, smell. Didn't found any sediments nor impurities either...
Since I have a Burns Folk Flute, I was reading Casey's website and found some flute care instructions, where he says:
"Almond oil can be used, but should be mixed with water
and decanted to remove water soluble impurities. A little vitamin E added helps keep the oil from going rancid."

So maybe this is related to food-grade almond oil? If anyone uses that kind of oil, any comment should be useful

flappy · Post by **flappy** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:36 pm

Well this is really new: mixed with water! Untill now I always thought it's impossible to mix water (aqueous substance) with any oil... In this case water is just a temporary element to clean 'dirty' oil. My question is: is it so important to use a 100% pure oil for your flute?
Anyway thanks for your information.

Jack Bradshaw · Post by **Jack Bradshaw** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:36 pm

Feadin wrote:I've got my almond oil from a pharmacy too and found it's completely clear and has barely, if any, smell. Didn't found any sediments nor impurities either...
Since I have a Burns Folk Flute, I was reading Casey's website and found some flute care instructions, where he says:
"Almond oil can be used, but should be mixed with water
and decanted to remove water soluble impurities. A little vitamin E added helps keep the oil from going rancid."

So maybe this is related to food-grade almond oil? If anyone uses that kind of oil, any comment should be useful

Ahh ! Decanting w/ water seems like a real good trick.......just make sure to get it all out. (always used hazelnut oil myself...like the taste)

flappy · Post by **flappy** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:03 pm

Does it mean you can use any vegetal oil, like olive oil?
I heard once about allergy problems when your mouth is touching the embouchure of a flute made with cocus wood (Brya ebenus). Maybe some oil can increase this risk, and which one?

phcook · Post by **phcook** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:11 pm

Almond oil is usually sold for taking care of breast for women feeding babies; how could it stink?

A possibility is, it has been oxydated and is now too old.

Best

flappy · Post by **flappy** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:30 pm

The babies as customers should say: we think you're right!

Feadin · Post by **Feadin** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:35 pm

Yep, it's supposed to smell when it's too old..... but according to some, it doesn't ever stink, so I suppose it depends on the oil...

chas · Post by **chas** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 2:35 pm

flappy wrote:Well this is really new: mixed with water! Untill now I always thought it's impossible to mix water (aqueous substance) with any oil.

There actually are water-soluble oils. Water-oil solutions are used as combination lubricating/cooling fluids in machine tools.

flappy · Post by **flappy** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:06 pm

I learn something each day! But your comment is perceptive. I saw once somebody his cooling fluid prepare. Lubricant and much water together, you got some homogeneous milky liquid, but it's not fat enough for a flute.......

Post by **Nanohedron** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:53 pm

flappy wrote:Does it mean you can use any vegetal oil, like olive oil?
I heard once about allergy problems when your mouth is touching the embouchure of a flute made with cocus wood (Brya ebenus). Maybe some oil can increase this risk, and which one?

I know of one fellow who'll use anything at hand. Olive oil, corn (maize) oil, whatever. He's a fabulous player, so I don't think there's a problem with that.

It's been suggested that all oils in general will probably increase the sensitisation problems from exotic hardwoods (African blackwood, cocus, other rosewoods - dunno about cocobolo or mopane; I seem to recall that some can become sensitised to mopane, but it's less common than the others). It's the oils and resins already present in those woods that cause the problems, so other oils being a vehicle/facilitator for transference makes sense as far as it goes.

I have blackwood allergy, and before I started using a lip plate, oils certainly didn't help the situation. Whenever I oil the exterior, I make sure I really clean the lip plate with a dry paper towel afterward; I usually feel a slight burn even so, so I suspect that the oil I use does indeed wick up a little of the blackwood's natural oils/resins.

Just about all exotic hardwoods used to make flutes are members of the legume family, by the way.

flappy · Post by **flappy** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:22 pm

Hello Nanohedron. Many thanks for details and tricks about your own 'wood/oil' experience. When you say 'I oil the exterior', it means you have to oil this side too. My flute for instance has a varnish outside, so no oil on it. But is this good for the instrument, without a kind of 'breathing' through the wood? I have to dry it more often than an unvarnished flute, because of condensation?

Post by **Nanohedron** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:38 pm

flappy wrote:Hello Nanohedron. Many thanks for details and tricks about your own 'wood/oil' experience. When you say 'I oil the exterior', it means you have to oil this side too. My flute for instance has a varnish outside, so no oil on it. But is this good for the instrument, without a kind of 'breathing' through the wood? I have to dry it more often than an unvarnished flute, because of condensation?

Just to clarify, I rarely oil the outside of the flute. I don't think it's something one HAS to do. If the exterior surface of mine were varnished, like you I wouldn't oil that side at all; I wouldn't see the point of it.

I apply oil - when I do - for that hard-to-quantify issue of "playability", and to fill those microscopic pits and scratches that I assume are there in the interior, even though it seems to have a mirror-smooth finish. To tell the truth, I hardly even oil the inside at all; the blackwood of my flute is so dense and naturally resinous already that it sheds condensation like a dream. I believe that keeping a flute humidified is more important than oiling as far as maintenance goes. But that's just me.

What kind of wood is your flute made of, flappy?

Edit: Oops. Cocuswood. Right.

I wonder why it was varnished....

flappy · Post by **flappy** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:54 pm

No idea about the varnish. I purchaised it in a music shop last summer in Kilkenny (Ireland). Salesman didn't know who was the maker...........

talasiga · Post by **talasiga** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:57 pm

flappy wrote:Hi talasiga. uuuuuh yes, you're probably right! But I don't see the connection with Irish flutes (except Celtic roots). BTW do you know if linseed oil has same stinky problem as almond oil after a while?

Hi Flappy. I am happy to record like Matt Paris that I have never had any issues with almond oil becoming stinky. I use food grade health food store (nutritional) almond oil and have done so for over 35 years on my wooden and bamboo instruments in climates ranging from wet and dry tropics (India, Northern Australia and South Pacific), wet and cold, dry and cold, wet and hot, dry and hot, dry and cool, wet and cool, temperate (Australia, Himalayas, Britsh Isles and Ireland).

I think I must have said this umpteen times (is that a number?) in this forum. Almond oil itself is a source of vitamin E. It is the least rancid prone of any of the unsataurated vegetal oils bar olive. It has a monounsaturate content nearly on par with olive oil. Monounsaturates are relatively heat stable fats.

Check out the science of oils. The truth is out there .....