What's the point of the short F natural key?

[ChrisCracknell]

Regarding RH thumb hole. From playing various bagpipes with a RH thumb hole, the position of the thumb hole along the axis of the flute already requires a - for me - uncomfortable repositioning of the thumb from where I would naturally have it. I can only imagine that being more of a problem with a RH Thumb hole on a flute. I speak here as someone who is a big fan of a LH thumb hole on a flute, which works fine.

[ryarbrough]

I'm coming to this thread late, but just to add my 2 cents, I understand that the short 'fnat' came first and the long 'fnat' was added because it's not possible to go from 'd' to 'fnat' using the short 'fnat' key without also sounding the 'e.' So...the long 'fnat' was added for the particular note combination of 'd' to 'fnat' without sounding the 'e.' I find the short 'fnat' an easy key to use when the flute fits (my Copley fits). When I played a flute that was too big for my hands, the blocks on the short 'fnat' key interfered with covering the 'e' hole with my right ring finger.

I'm a long-time player and have tried the Rockstro-style grip (thumb on the side of the flute, pushing out) several times over the years and never mastered it. The flute is unstable in my hands. I use a three-point grip with the right pinky pressing out, with the right thumb available as needed as a post (without gripping the flute) to prevent downward pressure from the fingers on the holes pushing the flute out of my hands. Using Rockstro, I had to use a lot of hand pressure just to hold the flute during play, leading to hand fatigue. With the grip using the pinky pushing out and right thumb only as a post, very little pressure is required so no hand fatigue.

To correct one statement, Larsen has played a six-key flute exclusively for many years.

[Cyberknight]

To correct one statement, Larsen has played a six-key flute exclusively for many years.

Oops! Got that one wrong.

I use a three-point grip with the right pinky pressing out, with the right thumb available as needed as a post (without gripping the flute) to prevent downward pressure from the fingers on the holes pushing the flute out of my hands.

This may be another reason not to have an F natural hole. I find that it can be difficult to have enough downward pressure to cover the holes adequately when my right thumb is off the instrument, because the whole flute pushes downwards. It's not *impossible* - especially if my pinky grip is firm - but it's a bit difficult. What are your thoughts on this? Do you think an F natural hole for the right thumb would be manageable, the way you play?

Another thing: if you use your pinky as an anchor point rather than using the Rockstro hold, how do you go about using the pinky key for D#? Do you ever play tunes with D#s in them? If so, how do you manage applying pressure while also using this key (doesn't using it require you to take your pinky off the instrument momentarily)? And how do players like Larsen do this?

[ryarbrough]

I infer that you mean an fnat hole on the underside of the flute to be covered by the right thumb. I have no experience with such a hole and it would require a lot of re-tooling for me. I'll stick with the keys.

[ryarbrough]

To complete my response, in the rare cases that I play a D#/Eb in ITM, I lift off the right pinky and use that to depress the Eb key. In addition, when playing, rolling or cranning the E, I also lift off the pinky because it's physically difficult for me to move my right ring finger without also moving the pinky. On those low notes I have a lot of fingers down that provide flute stability when combined with the right thumb, so I don't need the pinky.

I think some of our various grip preferences are down to hand physiology. While Rockstro is not useful to me, I have a friend whose terminal right thumb joint bends backward to angles I can't achieve. Rockstro is comfortable and useful for him.

[Tradman]

Historically, the short F came before they added the long F. It might have something to do with F-natural fingerings (XXX XOX?) from the baroque one-key flute, but I'm not sure about that.

I personally use the long-F key much more readily than the short-F, although the latter seems to be the preference for most trad flute players. I would say that when you are a new flute player the third finger of the right hand is stronger and more agile than the 4th finger or the left hand, although once you gain agility with practice, then you can quickly play long-F or G#.

Given that I prefer the long-F, I can readily use it to play in the keys of C, F and Bb. Then I came to Eb, and discovered that the small finger of the left hand needs to play both long-F and Ab, and that is is where you require the short F to handle the note changes. Admittedly this does't come up very frequently in ITM music, but I have a wonderful tune in C-minor (3 flats), where it becomes necessary to figure that out.

This is the answer I've been waiting for! Thanks for such a detailed reply. I've got a 6 key that I adore, but admittedly have only found a real use for the F natural so far. I've not sought out many tunes that required the other keys (other than I adore the long C key too for slow airs- much smoother) and so I've often wanted to read something akin to your reply here.

Eric