Fingers ache...

[In The Woods]

Hello, everybody.

I can get a really nice tone from my Tipple D flute (let's hear it for Doug! and his wonderful flute) but I find that after trying to go three times with the same tune my fingers start to ache and cramp up. I would like to be able to play a set or two, but at this rate I need a break between each tune in the set. What am I doing wrong? (Besides probably not practicing enough?)

Thank you to all who reply.

PS: This problem is *especially* noticeable when I play faster.

With best regards to all.

Steve Mack

[Aanvil]

Are you gripping too tight?

I find that I need to check myself from time to time.

That death grip will wear you out fast.

Doug's flutes have quite a stretch and large holes that take some work getting used to.

Later when you trade up you'll find it easy to do so.

[ImNotIrish]

Sounds like your grip may be to tight. Do you feel like you hands are tense? Do you feel as though you may drop the flute at any moment? I know I had this problem when I started and it was just a matter of relaxing the way I held the flute. Also, you may want to try some finger stretching exercises.

[Cork]

...but I find that after trying to go three times with the same tune my fingers start to ache and cramp up. I would like to be able to play a set or two, but at this rate I need a break between each tune in the set. What am I doing wrong? (Besides probably not practicing enough?)...

About that Death Grip...

Really, a flute doesn't weigh all that much, so it just doesn't take all that much effort to hold in place. Similarly, it just doesn't take all that much effort to close its holes with the fingers.

So, as a study, try seeing just how little effort, the absolute minimum effort, it could take to accomplish these tasks, but, of course, try this in a situation where the flute won't be harmed should it fall from your hands.

BTW, it's better to take a break should you need one, than to not.

[CranberryDog]

It wouldn't hurt to soak your hands in very warm water for a few minutes to relax your hands and fingers and limber things up a bit. Best, Cyril.

[jemtheflute]

Definitely a tension problem. Weight can't be an issue with a Tipple, though wide span might be, but I doubt it. Which really only leaves tension caused either by postural issues, or, if your posture and hold are optimised already, simply tension caused by.... tension! Trying too hard, straining to blow harder/make a bigger sound/move faster......etc. etc.

Solutions? Best if you can get someone who knows what they're doing to look at you and advise. Failing that, there have been loads of good threads on here about posture in general, about supporting the flute, about different ways of holding it and applying your hands to it for security and control and flexibility, about relaxing, about breath control and tone support and embouchure formation (yes, if you are fighting with those, that tension can spread....). Have a good browse and collect yourself half a dozen tips that you think may be most applicable to your need to work on (bookmark the rest for later attention!).

It is all about relaxation - not floppy, droopy (though that's a good place to start), but non-tense chosen, controlled posture and movement.

[greenspiderweb]

sorry, double post

[greenspiderweb]

As the others have said, excess tension is probably the cause, until you are comfortable with holding a flute, but if your hands are too small for the stretch of the holes, it can create even more tension.

Arthritis is another possibility, or even tendonits or simply just muscle aches from playing too much. Not long ago someone on Chiff wondered why his hands ached, and he said that he was playing for something like 14 hours a day or some unbelievable period of time like that!

Take a good long break, let your fingers and hands rest a bit, and go at it easy.

[bud]

Being a newbie both to C&F and to the flute, I wonder whether the forum has had some discussion on the various grips, such as "piper's" and "pennywhistle" methods. I'm feeling a bit awkward and open to suggestions.

[jemtheflute]

Being a newbie both to C&F and to the flute, I wonder whether the forum has had some discussion on the various grips, such as "piper's" and "pennywhistle" methods. I'm feeling a bit awkward and open to suggestions.

Loads! Try using the board's own search engine with keywords like "piper's grip" or "Rockstro hold" etc. You will find much that is helpful and much that is totally contradictory. It is a controversial, sometimes heatedly so topic! You just have to try out the alternatives for yourself and reach a choice, but not necessarily a final one! Lots of stuff about tension and strain injuries etc. here too, which often leads to discussion about ways to use/change posture etc. This was a good one for starters

[sbfluter]

I'll go against the grain and say that at first my hands ached as well, but it wasn't a death grip. It's the difficulty with the stretch. The holes are so big and so far apart it's a challenge to get them covered. I despaired of ever training my fingers to stay stretched apart. After a while the pain did go away and I became relatively nimble on it. Never as nimble as my small-handed folk flute however.

[Cork]

Being a newbie both to C&F and to the flute...I'm feeling a bit awkward and open to suggestions.

No need to feel awkward, here, and welcome to the Flute Forum!

[bud]

Being a newbie both to C&F and to the flute, I wonder whether the forum has had some discussion on the various grips, such as "piper's" and "pennywhistle" methods. I'm feeling a bit awkward and open to suggestions.

Loads! Try using the board's own search engine with keywords like "piper's grip" or "Rockstro hold" etc. You will find much that is helpful and much that is totally contradictory. It is a controversial, sometimes heatedly so topic! You just have to try out the alternatives for yourself and reach a choice, but not necessarily a final one! Lots of stuff about tension and strain injuries etc. here too, which often leads to discussion about ways to use/change posture etc. This was a good one for starters

*******************************


Great stuff! Thanks so much. It will take me a while to go through it all and apply it to my efforts. Finger stretching exercises are indicated in my case. I noticed many years ago that one approach to playing an instrument does not work for everyone, since our hands, fingers, and arms are different. It usually means trying various approaches until you find the one that works best.

[bud]

I'll go against the grain and say that at first my hands ached as well, but it wasn't a death grip. It's the difficulty with the stretch. The holes are so big and so far apart it's a challenge to get them covered. I despaired of ever training my fingers to stay stretched apart. After a while the pain did go away and I became relatively nimble on it. Never as nimble as my small-handed folk flute however.

Diane, I'm playing a Tipple also. I read somewhere that flutes with straight barrels, such as the Tipple, have larger and more widely spaced fingering holes than flutes with tapered barrels. Which may mean that if I can conquer the noting on a Tipple, I can probably play anything.

[jemtheflute]

Bud, it is true as a generalisation that flutes with cylindrical and wide bores will have larger, more widely spaced tone-holes, yes, although ergonomic compromises are available - read Doug's website if you haven't before, plus search for C&F threads on "small hands", "ergonomic fingerholes" etc.

Without wishing to be pedantic (I can't help it, I am), and to help you not to get confused, we mostly apply the term "barrel" to the lower section of the tuning slide on the common C19th design of simple system flutes. The main tube might be referred to as "the tube", "the body", "the main joint" (if it is in one piece!) etc., but not "the barrel". Jargon, jargon, I know!

You are probably right that, if you can sort out hand/finger position on a Tipple D flute to seal the holes reliably and play fluently and comfortably, you shouldn't have any major problems with conical bore wooden ones if and when you upgrade - only if you go for bigger, lower pitch instruments (e.g. low C, Bb). I you can't settle with the Tipple, don't despair - ask Doug about an ergonomic finger-tube, or try to get to try out some wooden flutes at a music shop or a session to see which direction you need to head in.