Native American flutes--anyone own one?

[Tyler]

I've been getting into the Native American flutes a little more, and bought one several weeks back, an F#m that sounds so good that it justifies every last dollar of the two hundred I spent on it...
I'd post photos, but I cancelled my home internet service (so all I have is my work internet...if my boss is reading...it's another Tyler than the one you know ), so when I get different service I'll post some.
I'd be really interested in what Walden might have to say on the topic of Native American instruments.
Cheers

[BigDavy]

Hi Tyler

I have two - Am and Gm. All I need to do is learn to play the blasted things. MIOA is me.

David

[Wombat]

I have an F#m and another hanging around somewhere. I think you'll find that a lot of us have at least one.

[Walden]

I have three. The only one I currently play is in A minor. I've posted a few clips in the past.

[GaryKelly]

Dale put up a NAF forum not so long ago, but sadly it expired through lack of use.

Which reminds me, I still haven't got my Am NAF back from the security guard I loaned it to!

[susnfx]

I don't know anything about the flutes myself, but I do know a little story about a guy who played them in southern Utah. He was a sort of hippie move-in...one of these people who move into southern Utah to get back to nature. He took up the NA flute, I suppose thinking that was an aid to being at one with the natural world. He would show up at the Paria River Outpost (a restaurant/music center in the middle of nowhere near the Paria River Wilderness Area) and attempt to play his flute during lulls in the country-western music being played by the other musicians/bands. I noticed after a few weeks that he was playing in the little snack/kitchen area and asked one of the regular guitarists why he wasn't playing out on the big patio where all the mics are set up. The guitarist told me, "I told him he should play in there instead of out here where people come to hear the real music."

So if you take it up, you might want to be cautious about where you choose to play it--you might just get sent to the kitchen to play!

Susan

[Tyler]

Dale put up a NAF forum not so long ago, but sadly it expired through lack of use.

Yeah, I started posting in a thread in the whistle forum with a couple other NAF players because the forum itself never caught on...

Are there any particular makers that people prefer...?
mine was made by a fellow out of Michigan who calls his business Spirit Flutes, if I remember right.

Walden--I was hoping you might be able to shed some light on how far back this type of Native American music goes...I don't have a great deal of faith in some sources (local) which give conflicting histories.
How "authentic" is it? I have read in one or two places on the internet where it is claimed that the current NAF is a 20th century development, is this true?

[susnfx]

Most of the websites I found only advertise makers. This one gives a little background, with some suggestions about when the flute arrived in NA culture.

http://www.spottedeagle.com/flutes.htm

Susan

[Walden]

Walden--I was hoping you might be able to shed some light on how far back this type of Native American music goes...I don't have a great deal of faith in some sources (local) which give conflicting histories.
How "authentic" is it? I have read in one or two places on the internet where it is claimed that the current NAF is a 20th century development, is this true?

Certainly flutes made of river cane were in use among the first tribes encountered by Europeans.

As in other societies, American Indians embraced the newer manufactured instruments, such as fifes, Jew's harps, harmonicas, etc. These things were used in barter. Lewis & Clark carried a supply of Jew's harps on their journey for use as gifts for tribesmen.

Some of the older people in our community played on things like walkingstick flutes (really whistles). Thus, the musical tradition itself is an authentic cultural tradition, but much of the modern conventions of instrument making, regarding NAF, are newly nvented, or reinvented. It's much the same as the story of the recorder. It was revived by people interested in "early music," who wished to play something closer to what the music was originally played on. Some of these recorder folks, in a lack of understanding, bored out the conical bore into a cylindrical bore, with no more malice for the instrument than the need to turn it into something they knew how to play. As time went by, and people became more acquainted with the physics of recorders, and with the historical material, they had to sort of retrace the process. So it is with NAF. It is undergoing a revival. The old flutes, not unlike recorders, varied a lot, and in order to be able to play one instrument or another, conventions have begun to develop. Certain numbers of tone holes are increasingly becoming standardized. Makers are using wood, more, as it is sturdier than river cane, and can be made in larger, low-pitched sizes. So, yeah in a sense it's new invention, but in another sense it's anything but.

[Tyler]

Thanks Walden!

[The Weekenders]

I have a cedar flute in Am (end blown), one of those with a bird over the window that's adjustable. I have used it a lot in school assemblies for some native California tunes. But really, its way too sweet and perfect for what was used here.

Like Walden said, some types of tule (a reed) were more likely as building material.. I think that what I am playing are actually vocal melodies put onto the flute, whereas the whistles they used, "pitos" they were called, were more like two or three tone whistles that were more rhythmic than melodic in some of the descriptions by early Spanish explorers. There are ethnnomusicologist recording and such from the turn of the century. But the closest thing to what I imagine was prevalent of the melodic style may be found today played by the Mayo Indians down in Sinaloa. I have a recording of a tune on their whistle that's pretty cool, but much more rustic in every way than my cedar flute.

I did some recording of Papago and one other tribe (can't remember now who it was) funereal tunes for the National Park Service Anza Project (which incidentally, was used on a West German tv news feature, yes, I'm famous). I used a Bolivian cane six-hole whistle that I found in a tourist trap in Nevada City. It's in Ab sorta and cost me $3. I recorded with both it and the cedar and chose the former. A Papago tribal guy recognized the tune and endorsed its use for the NPS (which was a little personal thrill for me).

The cedar flutes come in 5 or 6 hole generally and some have a leather thong that will block out one of the holes and make it into a 5-hole in case you learned that way. That's kinda cool. There is a store in Calistoga that has a huge selection of 'em if you ever go on vacation there.

[brewerpaul]

[quote="WaldenAs in other societies, American Indians embraced the newer manufactured instruments, such as fifes, Jew's harps, harmonicas, etc. These things were used in barter. Lewis & Clark carried a supply of Jew's harps on their journey for use as gifts for tribesmen.
.[/quote]

Please... we prefer to call them Hebrew American harps...

[jsluder]

As in other societies, American Indians embraced the newer manufactured instruments, such as fifes, Jew's harps, harmonicas, etc. These things were used in barter. Lewis & Clark carried a supply of Jew's harps on their journey for use as gifts for tribesmen.

Please... we prefer to call them Hebrew American harps...

[Innocent Bystander]

(This is going to be good...)
I was recently at a Powwow in Somerset, UK. I was dragged there by a couple of friends who are into Native American stuff and, slightly to my surprise, I had a really good time. There were Native Americans there from America and Canada. I had a pleasant chat with a Lady who was Micmac. Heard some wonderful music and danced a few dances, when I was allowed. Did a fair amount of earwigging and learned as much as I could pick up about the songs and how they were constructed, and about the whistles and how they were constructed (I make my own penny-whistles from PVC tubing).
But the the pipes really didn't take me. As I am a penniless wretch, and these things were 60 quid for a plain model (that would be 80 dollars American, I think) they were out of my league. But the stallholder kindly explained how they were constructed, and how they were played. They had usually five finger-holes, and if they DID have six, then the sixth hole was always covered in playing. You would NOT be able to play Irish Trad on them (for instance). They would make a lovely sound, and you could play Native American, naturally.
So... since the Micmac lady said that the tribal elders in Europe were much more strict in maintaining the traditions than the tribal elders in the U.S. & Canada ... my question is:
Are you proud possessors of Native American Whistles only playing Native American on them, or are YOUR Native American whistles debased versions that will play two full octaves (European)?
Are we (in Europe) more NAtive American than you????
No. I'm serious!!! (mostly)

[The Weekenders]

No, mine has a somewhat limited range and is basically an Aminor whistle. I play Indian melodies and one chinese Gold Rush tune on it using a limited scale. Not a tinwhistle range or usage. The highest notes have to be approached with care. I know what you are describing and that is what I have seen here in all the Native American arts and crafts shops and at fairs.