Loudness/volume problems in sessions?

Gunslinger · Post by **Gunslinger** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:57 am

Terve, everybody!

On this forum people have reported about their problems to get heared when playing in sessions. Well, I have no problem at all now that I mainly play in the 3rd and fourth octave. Now this is where the whistle really starts to kick in! With the normal instrument setup I don't usually need any amplification at all. Actually I found the sound of most of my whistles, even Susatos, to be somewhat wavery and weak in the second and especially in the first octave.

Whenever I play in sessions people come to ask about my technique and they tell that my playing really stands out from the other players. A funny thing was when I was practising some reels and airs during lunch hour at a park nearby, some construction workers came complimenting me and asked the usual questions "what is that instrument?" and told me that they could hear the beautiful sounds of music even through their hearing protecters and 200 meters away inside a building!

Br, Heikki Petäjistö

MTGuru · Post by **MTGuru** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:03 am

Hi Heikki ... are you having a little fun with us?

Even if it were possible, I can't believe that playing Irish dance music in the 3rd and 4th octaves of a normal whistle wouldn't be:

1. Impractical
2. Unmusical
3. Lethal

Or maybe I completely misunderstand what you are describing?

Pyroh · Post by **Pyroh** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:37 am

MTGuru wrote:Hi Heikki ... are you having a little fun with us?

Even if it were possible, I can't believe that playing Irish dance music in the 3rd and 4th octaves of a normal whistle wouldn't be:
1. Impractical
2. Unmusical
3. Lethal
Or maybe I completely misunderstand what you are describing?

I thought the same, I doubt this can be done.

I measured the frequencies - D and E in third octave are damn high frequencies, and looking at graph of frequency development, fourth octave would be totally ultrasonic

Considering how ear-piercing is just the lowest part of third octave, higher notes and fourth octave would be totally horrible (and ultrasonic, i.e. unhearable).

Ceili_whistle_man · Post by **Ceili_whistle_man** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:25 am

Third octave on most whistles is screechingly awful enough (the top end of it anyway for those who can reach it) without even contemplating a fourth octave!!

wvwhistler · Post by **wvwhistler** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:36 am

I can't say I've ever read about anyone hitting the fourth octave! I have to agree with MTguru about the lethalness of it after having heard the third on a D.

Bothrops · Post by **Bothrops** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 6:38 am

In my Susato VSB in D (one of my quieter Susatos) the note D of the 3rd octave is rather uncomfortable to my ears. I don't think someone could play everything in the 3rd and 4th octave (unless you're deaf!)

Also, as someone said, the 3rd and 4th octave doesn't sound good and can be sharp.

fearfaoin · Post by **fearfaoin** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 8:11 am

The owner of my local woodwind shop is an incredible flautist, so his breath
control is top-notch. When he plays tinwhistle, it is exclusively in the 2nd and
3rd octave. It's extremely musical, in tune and amazing (though piercing).

But I refuse to believe there is such a thing as "playing" in the 4th octave.
I think you may have to make a recording of that, if human technology can
pick it up...

hydromel89 · Post by **hydromel89** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 9:22 am

Every time I have to (try to) reach the D on the third octave, I find myself about to become deaf... Didn't even try to go furthuer up!

How can someone even reach the fourth octave?

anniemcu · Post by **anniemcu** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 10:58 am

Of all the whistles that I've had the opportunity to have tried so far, and that is a bunch, perhaps two have been able to be taken into the lower reaches of the third octave comfortably, without permanent hearing damage, and little or no residual scarring from the sharp objects hurled at me from the corner of the room that my youngest inhabits.

I make absolutely no claims to expert-ness, nor do I know it all, but good gravy, Heikki, what sort of whistles and players are you talking about????? this jes ain't happenin' in our usual experience.

FinnWhistler · Post by **FinnWhistler** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 1:43 pm

Gunslinger wrote:Terve, everybody!

On this forum people have reported about their problems to get heared when playing in sessions. Well, I have no problem at all now that I mainly play in the 3rd and fourth octave. Now this is where the whistle really starts to kick in! With the normal instrument setup I don't usually need any amplification at all. Actually I found the sound of most of my whistles, even Susatos, to be somewhat wavery and weak in the second and especially in the first octave.........

Br, Heikki Petäjistö

I know, that it is impossible to play in the fourth octave - even in Finland, but meybe Heikki means, that he plays for example from c3 to b4 :-). Maybe he is a pianoplayer too, so that would explane his octaves.

FJohnSharp · Post by **FJohnSharp** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 3:12 pm

If he is playing in the 4th octave, this would explain the reports of rats and pigeons suddenly fleeing the city. And the fact that his audiologist has been put on retainer.

Key_of_D · Post by **Key_of_D** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 6:34 pm

Maybe he means negative 3rd and 4th octave???

MTGuru · Post by **MTGuru** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 7:57 pm

FJohnSharp wrote:If he is playing in the 4th octave, this would explain the reports of rats and pigeons suddenly fleeing the city. And the fact that his audiologist has been put on retainer.

Really! When I experiment for any length of time with 3rd octave fingerings, as jemtheflute and I were doing a few weeks ago, I have to wear ear protection, -30 dB earplugs. Otherwise it's painful, and possibly dangerous.

I like this part:

Gunslinger wrote:Whenever I play in sessions people come to ask about my technique and they tell that my playing really stands out from the other players.

Holy smoke, I should think so. Because at that point the other players are either dead or writhing on the floor in agony.

FinnWhistler wrote:I know, that it is impossible to play in the fourth octave - even in Finland, but meybe Heikki means, that he plays for example from c3 to b4 . Maybe he is a pianoplayer too, so that would explane his octaves.

But he says he can also play in the 1st and 2nd octaves. If that means from A0 to A2, then that is a VERY BIG contrabass whistle he's playing. Or maybe your clean Suomi air really does have magical properties!

Gunslinger · Post by **Gunslinger** » Thu Dec 13, 2007 2:13 am

Terve, everybody!

As many of you already found out, this was just a joke! In real world I can play a couple of notes on the third octave, but I mainly play those notes on my A and Bb whistles only. With higher whistles the higher notes do tend to be a bit too shrill for my taste.

My car radio is broken and so I have time to entertain myself with silly ideas every day. Yesterday morning I got the idea about 3rd and 4th octave and I hope that you can forgive me sharing the idea with you...

I think it was quite obviously a joke when you think about "beautiful (???!!!) sounds of music heard even through their hearing protecters and 200 meters away inside a building"! If it was true, think about the volume level near the whistler; it would be something to make your ears (and probably your eyes and nose, too) bleed. Think about that kind of supersonic weapon in a session! Maybe in USA where handguns are are considered a civil right you could get away with going with that kind of weapon in public (if it existed), but here in Finland it would be forbidden.

Br, Heikki Petäjistö

Tommy · Post by **Tommy** » Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:44 am

Gunslinger wrote:Terve, everybody!

As many of you already found out, this was just a joke!

Hmmmm.... Snicker snicker lol LOL LOL LOL

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Loudness/volume problems in sessions?

Loudness/volume problems in sessions?

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