Buying a tin whistle

[castielowns1994]

Hi all! I've been thinking about buying a tin whistle, I simply love the sound of this instrument but I'm so confused. I read that there are a lot of keys, being D the most popular followed by C. Also, I read that your first tin whistle should be tuned in D to learn properly but my question is the following: I can play every song with this key? I mean, of course I want to play irish traditional music but if I want to play some other songs? In other keys? Like nightwish songs, concerning hobbits by howard shore... I dont know what kind of tin whistle buy...

Thanks in advance and sorry for any gramatical mistake, english isn't my first language

[sbfluter]

Most Irish tunes are going to be in a key that you can play on a D whistle so that is why that is the best one to start with. A D whistle will play key of D naturally, key of G with a special fingering for the C natural, key of A with a half-hole for the G# (but a lot of A tunes use a G natural or don't play a G at all). Many tunes will be in E, B or A minor, which will also fit on the D because they have the same one or two sharps.

Once in a while there will be a tune in D minor. Then you'd need a C whistle (or an F). We played one the other night in Bb so I would need a Bb whistle.

If you want to play Christmas carols from an old Lutheran hymnal or some such, you can get by with a Bb, Eb, D for the majority of tunes. Throw in a C and I think you could play just about everything under the sun.

The thing you will always struggle with are tunes that have lots of accidentals. You're pretty much stuck with music that doesn't stray much from the key signature it's written in.

Regarding your whistles in scales other than D, if you are the sheet music type, you sort of imagine that you're always playing in the key of D, G or A and you're always "looking" at sheet music in D, G or A. But when you're playing, it's coming out as something else. So for instance, were you to play Joy to the World, you'd pull out your D whistle and play it in the key of G. But if you were playing for someone to sing with and that was too high for them, you could play it one step down with C whistle and still play as if it were in the key of G only now it would sound like F and be easier for that person to sing with. Hope that makes sense.

[ickabod]

*Scratches Head*

Hmmm... where have I heard this before?? Could it be deja vu?

Hello there castielowns1994. I would like to invite you to take a look at this post of: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=101349

You might find something in there that is helpful. This question has come up before believe it or not The question is kind of like a strange cosmic time loop that keeps re-occurring on the chiff and fipple.

By the way, English is my first language and that doesn't prevent me from making tons of grammatical errors. Go figure

Welcome!!

[s1m0n]

Whistles are what's known as a transposing instrument, which means that while they can come in a number of keys, when it comes to written music and basic nomenclature, it's conventional to act like all whistles are D whistles. This is another reason why people are advised to begin with a D whistle - if you're learning using notation [not necessarily the case], the sound you make will match what the page says, and if you play with other instruments, you can all read the same score.

But mostly it's because the bulk of the repertoire is D,G or A if you're playing irish trad.

[pancelticpiper]

D whistles are non-transposing instruments: you see the note C (natural) on the page and finger the note C and the note that is produced is C.

In ordinary music parlance one would say that "the written note is the same as the sounding note".

All other whistle keys are transposing, for example if you see the note C on the page and finger the note C but you're playing a C whistle, the note that is produced is B-flat.

In ordinary musical parlance instruments are called by the "sounding pitch" that's produced when C is fingered.

In Irish music whistles and flutes are called by the "sounding pitch" that's produced when D is fingered.

So an Irish flute in D is in the same pitch as an orchestral C flute. On both, G is fingered xxx ooo, D is fingered xxx xxx, and so forth.

Crazy I know.

[ickabod]

I read that your first tin whistle should be tuned in D to learn properly

I'm wondering where you read that... I've never come across any material that stated you must start with a D whistle to learn properly. "Properly" is very subjective term and really just a matter of opinion when it comes music. Music is after all based on theory. But, I would be interested in your source.

my question is the following: I can play every song with this key? I mean, of course I want to play irish traditional music but if I want to play some other songs? In other keys? Like nightwish songs, concerning hobbits by howard shore... I dont know what kind of tin whistle buy...

Thanks in advance and sorry for any gramatical mistake, english isn't my first language

I have seen statements like the following: (I believe Dale is the author of this statement. Keep in mind it is a bit outdated)
Tinwhistles are diatonic, meaning, not naturally made to play sharps and flats (although, happily, it can be done). Fortunately, most folk music is diatonic. Whistles are available in a variety of keys, designated by the lowest note the whistle is capable of playing. The most popular key is "D", because so much Irish/Celtic music is in D. The next most popular key is "C". These are your standard tinwhistles which are about a foot long. If you learn to play a tune in D on a D whistle, you can turn around, pick up a C whistle and play the same tune in C with the same fingering.

Whistle keys; high versus low whistles:

Different whistle makers offer whistles in different keys. Here's a semi-complete listing of keys available. Some day, when I have time, I'm going to try to make a table of what keys are available by what makers. In the meantime, in the whistle guides (Inexpensive, Expensive, and Low) I try to list these keys accurately by maker.

Highest key down to Lowest

G Rare and not very useful. Generation makes this key and I don't know of anyone else who does. My youngest daughter likes it because it's easy for her small hands to handle. Only certain species of dogs can hear the higher notes

F Generation makes an F and I think that's the only inexpensive F whistle. Jon Swayne makes one, I think. Mary Bergin plays the Generation some on Feadoga Stain. I adore the high F whistle and they were made by other makers. Gimme an "F".

E Rare key. Shaw makes one, which I like. I can't think of another.

Eb A bit more common. Generation makes one which I don't care for. Susato makes the best inexpensive one in my opinion.

D The workhorse. Everybody makes a D.

C The second most popular. MOST makers make a C. I generally do not like C whistles, my O'Riordan being an exception. I don't know why I don't like Cs but I just don't.

B Somewhat rare. Michael Burke makes a beauty in this key.

Bb I think these sound great. Fairly inexpensive models include Generation, Susato, Shaw. The middle range of keys, say, B, Bb, A to me have a special appeal and a real sonic advantage. Copeland told me that his favorite pitch is A.

Most people designate keys at A and below as "Low Whistles." (Although I think the proper place for this dividing line is between A and G. However if you see a whistle listed as "A", you can be sure it is a Low A because no one makes a high A. But, there are some LOW, LOW A whistles usually called baritones. There are relatively few really inexpensive Low whistles. The exception is the Susato line of plastic whistles, which are quite good and $40-55 US.

Low A. Susato makes an excellent Low A. Shaw makes a beautiful Low A, which requires a lot of breath.

Low G A pretty popular key. Susato, Thin Weasel, Copeland, O'Riordan, Overton, etc.

Low E (rare)

Low Eb

Low F (Shaw makes a moderately priced one)

Low D (the most popular low whistle. Riverdance!)

Low C, C# (somewhat uncommon and must be a beast to play.)

Low Bb, Low B, Low A These Ultimate Freudian Models are pretty much peculiar to three makers: Bernard Overton's Overtons, Colin Goldie's Overtons, and Phil Hardy's Kerry Pros. The sound of these whistles, played properly by big-handed people, upset continental plate tetonics.

Here is a link to the tutorial: http://www.chiffandfipple.com/tutorial.html

Really the only thing that I can think of that you may want to consider is the possibility of using the "Pipers Grip" if you elect to venture into Low Whistles. I have read before from different sources that you want to start with a "High whistle" first and then transition later to a low whistle. But, that is also subjective and there are many many varying opinions there as well.

[calanthrophy]

To answer the original questions as quickly as possible (if less accurately) and with the least amount of confusion:

Start with a D whistle.
You'll figure out the rest in time.

[whistlecollector]

Hi all! I've been thinking about buying a tin whistle, I simply love the sound of this instrument but I'm so confused. I read that there are a lot of keys, being D the most popular followed by C. Also, I read that your first tin whistle should be tuned in D to learn properly but my question is the following: I can play every song with this key? I mean, of course I want to play irish traditional music but if I want to play some other songs? In other keys? Like nightwish songs, concerning hobbits by howard shore... I dont know what kind of tin whistle buy...

Will have to second calantrhophy's sage advice here: buy a d whistle (doesn't really matter what kind) and learn to play it; you'll figure the rest out as you go along!

To answer some specific points: you should be able to play very many songs on a good whistle, but maybe not quite every song! Rhapsody in Blue might be a bit of a stretch, with that opening measure of a two-and-a-half octave run from low G up to way high c'! Haven't tried it myself. Ronde des Lutins has a good three octave plus range. That might be beyond most whistles (will have to give a kudos to Mack Hoover -- his narrow bore can get up to those stratospherically high bs).

The nice thing about the whistle is that, literally, you can buy a thousand dollar instrument or a ten dollar instrument and, with practice can make either one sound beautiful.

To play music outside the narrow ITM orbit, you will have to cultivate techniques that don't apply (much) to the ITM idiom. You'll have to learn how to deal with tunes in E or Ab, songs with accidentals and runs with accidentals and awkward interval jumping. Things that clarinet and flute players don't have to worry about, because they have all those keys. On a whistle, you'll have to make do with half-stopping holes to get those notes. Can be done, and it's not that hard.

Just remember: the tin whistle is nòt an "Irish" instrument. It just happens to be an instrument very popular with Irish music players. It can be used quite legitimately to play any music you want to play on it! Traditional, jazz, classical, religious, music of your own making. Just have fun with it!

[s1m0n]

Ignore every last one of us. Buy a D whistle and learn to make music out of it. Long before you'll have got that far, you'll be able to answer your questions better than any one of us. Nothing any of us has said is wrong, y'unnerstan. It just doesn't matter. You'll learn what you need to know as you go along. The important part is getting a whistle and starting to play it. Keep at it and all will become clear. Get intimidated and it won't matter what we've said.

[sbfluter]

Yeah, what Simon said. And if you're still conflicted, buy one of the $10-$40 ones. Really, it's only a few dollars. I remember when I first got started I ordered an Irish flute and while I was waiting for it, I happened to see $10 pennywhistles by the cash register at the music shop and bought one on a lark. Then I spent the next few weeks thinking wow, I really didn't need that expensive flute, this whistle is awesome!

[s1m0n]

Oh, and if you stay with the whistle, stick around on this site. Don't feel like we're genius musicians who can't possibly identify with your beginner problems or insights, because we're not and we do. In fact, we've had - or are still having - ALL your problems. When you have the courage to post about your struggles, remember that there are likely half a dozen lurkers with the same issue who won't post. So ask for them! And take their secret gratitude as given.